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I hope it's okay to have a harder last part, should be doable. Some skips are intentional. Thanks for everyone who has helped and/or will help on improving the map π
Decline
the whole part is pretty difficult comparing to parts before, but at least remove this wall as shotgun option, otherwise it's misleading. you can do it with this wall, but you lose dj on right side and trying to get up without dj is insane but not impossible
and maybe 1-2 more tiles on platform to run on, it feels too close
i use that wall to do the part, idk what u are doing xd
that part is easy if you know how to do it properly :p
good map, some parts are harder than others
Yeah didn't look too closely on the balancing, i made the parts how i like them the most, i will try to make part 2 harder (2 shotguns needed not only 1 shot)
Some smaller fixes, oof forgot something
will try to make teleporter 2 and 3 a bit harder, when i find the time.. part 2 has the teleporter 1 (and so on), so the numbers are confusing
welf!
last part hard
nice parts as always
hookables on outside of map a little sloppy tho
i think it's fun to do the climb after u finished the map. will keep more players on my map.
i rly like this
Rls
decline
corner
its worth fixing
you have this cp10 system going on here, why not just add a tele10 to cp10 column to the these converters. would be more consistent
after that its ready
i don't want to change that
why
why do you ask
I care about this map and saw improvements. I don't say I am right, I am open for any discussion to figure out a working solution. and you talk saying you don't mind bugs in your map and you defend a useless thing for no reason with no reason, how can I take you any serious now. You seem to care more about changing the least possible things to get a quick release than you care about the quality of the map and having an open minded and respectful discussion with the testers. So fix this and the map is ready or give me good reason why this is a bad fix.
There is alot you can discuss on maps and i don't feel like wasting time in having long talks about small stuff like this. E.g. this is just noticeable after you finished the actual map and only with entities, so why does it matter? Maybe your solution is a tiny bit better, but i don't support focussing on that. I also don't support you kinda forcing me to change this little thing, because that's not your job as a tester. It's not your job to force me to talk about this little teleporter either. I really want you to understand that we humans will always have different views and should learn to accept that others have their own way of perception. You saw that i changed the parts you wanted me to change earlier, so don't act as if i was sturdy xd If i just wanted a quick release, i would just listen to what you tell me to do like a loyal son, so i don't think you put alot of thought into your words.
Since i started talking about my map: The aim of this map was to suggest the players to try speedrunning. There are multiple ways. The parts you wanted me to change earlier (teleporter 2 and 3) are very easy, because i somewhat wanted to make the map from a speedrun perspective. So the parts are there to suggest the player to speedrun it. If it's easy, you can try to play it as fast as possible. I'm worried that one part has a rather annoying speedrun way, so it might annoy the speedrunners. Also a friend told me that the last part is hard to speedrun. I am actually worried about that stuff and i guess i will learn from this map when i see speedrunners playing it. (The speedrun thing is also a reason why the map is rather short. Obviously i am also worried about cuts.)
I wanted to give you my view on this map and what i think what to consider when talking about the map.
I don't know if you care, but i showed this map to other players before uploading it and i (tried to) fix all the cheesy alternative ways and i listened to their feedback. Nobody of them forced me to change something or forced me to discuss about why i don't want to change something XD
I also don't think that many players will speedrun this, but i guess at least i tried. I don't like deleting the part at teleporter 4, even if the speedrun way is really annoying, because i like a move you can do at that part XD
(this is not the fastest way afaik)
I usually think alot about some stuff on my maps and i wanted to give you an example. Actually a few ideas in this map are somewhat older ideas. I had to simplify some parts, because the map is somewhat minimalistic in its style. I kinda like the idea to make the map look minimalistic, while actually there was some work on the parts to make them look like they are xD i can show you an older version of the teleporter 2 part:
I hope this all makes sense to you xd
the map is solid, a bit short but good parts. and I really like the changes on the parts you did and now it's ready from a gameplay side. but testing is oviously not only gameplay, and you saying gameplay 100% matters is a bold statement. you said I force you on anything here, which is quite the opposite. I clearly said I am open for any input from you, which you now gave me. allthough quite off topic as the gameplay is finished and the sole purpose of showing me your in depth gameplay thoughts was to defend the statement that you don't care about the map.
whatever, this is all just TL;DR I only really care now about this last fix and you said my solution might be better but you don't want to focus on that. I don't really understand why you don't want to focus on improvements but idc at this point, I have an solution now.
$ready 2
there is a reason why this map is "short". i am not sure if the map is ready from a gameplay side, but thank you for telling me. i didn't say that gameplay 100% matters, you saw me hiding some cp tiles already. i cared about making it look clean while mapping.
for me it seemed like you wouldn't make this ready if i just said that i don't want to change that stuff without giving you a reason. that's the opposite of being open, that's forcing me. please don't do that and pretend like you didn't do it. just say that it's okay that i don't want to change it next time.
i guess it's good to have my view on the map in this channel, so others can understand and maybe even criticise me in my thought proccess.
So fix this and the map is ready or give me good reason why this is a bad fix. yeah at that point I was forcing you because I felt like you were unreasonable and avoiding me. hoping that I just give up and say it's fine does not make any sense when I am genuinely looking for improvements. Holy shit this is so ridiculous and repetitive, I am done now. I am not your enemy, and I hope next time we can get better along because I really think you are a good mapper even though you are not easy to work with at all
You are not easy to work with at all. You even admitted that you forced a change and you admitted that it's a really small thing. I even wanted to skip this writing, but you forced that. Don't blame me for your faults. Thanks π
congratz welf
for rls
I don't care about this map at all. I just wanted to upload it in case anybody likes it.
writing that and uploading your own version of the map in the same discord message is kinda rude. you should work on your social skills. it's quite manipulative.
call me rude all you want, if anyone has any sense of common sense and can read what I wrote they can form their own opinion. you are just attacking me for no reason, I even said I offered to work with you and not be your enemy and you tell me I should work on my social skills. so you don't care about the map and don't want my fixed version, should I decline it instead?
i agree with ReD. Idk whats wrong with mappers this days that doesnt want to change minor things... (even if its to make the map better) lol
if you are not my enemy, please be nice with me and don't be manipulative. i am not attacking you. i am telling you why i felt offended. i don't know if you understand the difference.
next time just make the map ready after i said i don't want to
that would've been alot easier for all of us
but no you do this
you are reacting like this over a cp and you call me manipulative because I order you to just GIVE ME A REASON, not even force you to change it you are just annoying me now, why in the hell is it even worth it to write about this more than 3-4 sentences. seriously, it you now don't stop I will care as much about the map as you do
i called you manipulative, because you told me that you are not forcing me and at the same time you are literally forcing the change by uploading your own version of my map. do you think that this behaviour is not manipulative?
because we both agreed it's a better solution
and you said you don't want to focus on that ok this is very easy, if you like your maps in entities, no bugs in design or clean cp solutions, you will clash with testing. than you should play the map yourself or on your own server and not here
But Welf you started. By saying "not worth fixing but fixed anyway" like u dont care. Or replying rude when u said "why do you ask" that shows disrespect for a tester that helps u out
maybe i prefer the map with having this little "flaw". i don't like this perfectionism at all.
you changed it even when i said i don't want to change it
ok I force you for the change do you accept it or not?
why do you ask
very funny, last chance, can you accept my fixed version or not
just because u have been Tester leader doesnt mean u can have a quick rls or doesnt have problems in ur map
if u dont give a f about this map why upload it? give it to someone that is willing to even do "1 single cp placement"
this should've been declined as "the way around" map, as bcs it got decline for not changing stuff when need for improvement
you can clearly see that ReD said "would be more consistent" and u said u made if for speedrunners. If its more consistent its better for to speedrun it
i just want to know what happens if i say no, because you sound quite oppressive rn
or this "not worth fixing"
i even fixed it i don't know why you feel offended by me saying that it's not worth for me
why would anybody feel offended over that
i have a different view but i still changed it
literally the opposite of forcing anything
how come corners are not worth fixing ?
wtf
i wont discuss about corners
dont bring 2013 maps then
yeah I wasnt forcing you on anything before, but now I am because you're just annoying and not to be worked with
maps are evolving
I have a DΓ©jΓ -vu
And then this..... what kind of answer is that when a TESTER is trying to help u with suggestions
i dont see how ReD is forcing u at all
i don't want to answer your question, what happens if i don't or if i say no? you didn't even answer me...
I resort to your version and $reset, because than it's not ready as I see an improvement that could be made and until than the map is not ready to be released
i might need some time to think about an answer in this case
that's reasonable, feel free to upload to your own fixed version if you want to do it yourself maybe you can find a way to abandon the cp converters and only use normal cps
you were forcing me all the time since you never gave me the option to say no.
if start talking respectfully and open minded I am open for anything really, but not for this "i dont want to" and "i know it better" bullshit
until your decision I will reset it in case you need a few days and it get's scheduled in that time
$reset
ok i accept your change
alright
$ready 2
Welf, your map hasnt even been for soooo long in testing, more like a week and a half or near 2 weeks. There are maps that needed 2 years, 6 months, 1 year etc etc etc and maps that are still on testing rn. And its already getting released. People wish to have the chance u got so atleast you could be grateful you have a chance like this and stop complaining and acting like you know better than us "all the time" (i dont include me)
QuiX, I think it should stop here let's not keep this fire going, I am not mad at him for being ungrateful, he had his points and I had mine, and now it's done
and im having mine ReD
i wish i could be him
post 1 map 2 weeks rls
2 weeks after rls on ddnet
well this channel is offtopic af at this point
i never said that "i know better" btw. i don't know what's the "best" for this map. also i fixed the corners so i really don't understand what the issue about that was (i think that was not your issue with me red, but quix talked about that).
i know that i am lucky with this map getting a ready early (maybe that has something to do with the map being made by an experienced mapper). i never asked to test this map asap or to release this map asap.
only 3 screens has been sent to fix map xDD the rest is full of aggresive comentaries xD
ravie did some suggestions on a server a few days ago. i don't know if i accepted all, but at least one part was changed after his suggestions.
we know you are an experienced mapper you were even in testing lead and i appreciated all your help when u helped me on my map β₯. But i think you should atleast consider the oppinions and idk maybe remake it in a way that satisfies you and people that suggest it π
map is really beautiful Welf ^-^ we arent attacking u at all (atleast i wasnt)
and if this didnt work atleast you could say that idk you tried it but u didnt like it or something nicier xD
i already mentioned that i agreed to some suggestions. do you think that i should agree to every suggestion?
nono ofc not haha consider doesnt mean agree to all
but anyway. Lets just move on π
typical Welf thread "XD"
this thing is really unnecessary and weird glitch is noticeable
you can remove unfreeze next to CTO9
nice he rq'ed again
quick someone find a big bug so we can reset it
he just saw saavik and ran away
lmao
what weird glitch?
maybe she's talking about the speed glitchy thing? like in slak?
when you tp between parts
so no speedups?
it's not about speedups
its about this special tp room
It's a bit hacky but works and removes cp tile spam, which would otherwise be needed