00:00 < Learath2> the game is actually very hard
00:00 <@deen> Sure, but that's why it's fun
00:00 < Learath2> its like a habit for us it seems easy but moving around aint easy at all
00:01 <@deen> I can't even play it when I'm on a 50fps screen and my mouse isn't moving 100% well
00:01 < Learath2> yeah i feel weird with a different mouse and stuff
00:02 <@deen> but i always liked hard games, you can play them for years and keep improving and don't get bored
00:02 < Learath2> anyways i invited like 5 of me friends and only one is playing decent and that one can only play aip gores
00:04 < Learath2> well easy games aint fun
00:39 < eeeee> deen: sounds like you'd enjoy the original xcom then, why don't you play it?
00:39 <@deen> I'm playing too much already :P
00:40 < eeeee> hm yeah guess thats a valid point
00:53 < ochristi> meh can't we just play stupid attackers
01:46 < eeeee> looks like someone is already playing stupid attackers
02:01 < ochristi> hehe, the fun with ambiguity
02:21 < eeeee> lvrg the comma next time :P
11:10 < Savander> deen, who organizing maps for race?
12:05 < Nimda> The Tower by Jeet just released on Ddmax at 2015-07-10 12:00
12:05 < Nimda> Stamina by Ion just released on Ddmax at 2015-07-10 12:00
12:05 < Nimda> Standby by Zerodin just released on Ddmax at 2015-07-10 12:00
12:05 < Nimda> Steff III peace by Tsin just released on Ddmax at 2015-07-10 12:00
12:05 < Nimda> Steff I beginning by Tsin just released on Ddmax at 2015-07-10 12:00
13:18 <@deen> Savander: Index, Welf, aaa and Sorah I think
13:22 <@deen> Savander: Also, I hope Tsin won't be too mad that we released his maps
13:23 < Learath2> deen: but but but ddmax is coming back didnt you hear ?
13:23 <@heinrich5991> Learath2: is it?
13:24 < Learath2> http://ddmaxforum.noother.net/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=954&sid=ac07244b2aa2ea7824628427ec039a69
13:24 <@deen> Learath2: I've been hearing promised new features of ddmax even before ddnet started
13:24 < Learath2> ddmax has been coming back since 2012
13:25 < Learath2> and tsin tried to talk me into coding stuff for ddmax for weeks before it died :P
13:25 <@heinrich5991> well, managing projects is hard
13:25 <@heinrich5991> like really hard
13:25 <@heinrich5991> deen and GreYFoX managed to do it
13:26 <@heinrich5991> I definitely haven't managed to do so yet
13:26 <@deen> I think Tsin did well for the time DDmaX was up
13:26 <@deen> He did a lot of testing and DDmaX was popular
13:26 <@heinrich5991> I didn't interact with ddmax a lot, so I don't know
13:26 < Learath2> Greyfox also did well but it took way too much time for him
13:27 <@heinrich5991> I doubt it's not also taking too much time from deen tbh
13:27 <@deen> DDmaX had the main European DDRace community
13:27 < Learath2> it obv is taking too much time from deen he is always around even
13:33 < Savander> Tsin shouldn't be mad
13:33 < Savander> i guess
13:33 <@deen> Savander: well, he was mad the last time we discussed releasing one of his maps
13:33 < Savander> you mean, his own?
13:33 <@deen> yes
13:33 <@deen> but haven
13:34 <@deen> 't heard from him since then
13:34 < Savander> ah, it's another point
13:34 < Savander> i thought about all maps from ddmax
13:34 <@deen> yeah, he's mad about that too
13:35 < Savander> "I truly wonder.... Who the fuck told you all that project is dead ? =] I must admit that I don't have any plans to post anything about closed beta(tooo bugy - not rdy - comebackzorlaterzorokploxthxcu) of new ddmax in april but june and july are such nice months ^^."
13:35 < Savander> 10 July
13:36 < Savander> i don't believe, that will start soon...
13:37 < Learath2> deen: is nim okay with circular dependency ?
13:37 <@deen> the main problem are the ddos attacks currently. if he didn't have this nice ddos protection, we would've been down 15 times yesterday
13:37 <@deen> Learath2: nope
13:37 < Savander> that's why ddmax
13:38 < Learath2> mmh so ill have to seperate the shared functions into another module then
13:38 <@deen> Learath2: it's considered a sign of bad design and you're supposed to avoid it, but there are a few tricks to make it work
13:38 < Savander> went down
13:38 < Learath2> well plugins need some functions to interact with the bot and the bot needs some functions on the plugins to interact with them
13:38 <@deen> maybe forward declarations can help
13:39 <@heinrich5991> can you provide a interface that modules have to conform to?
13:39 <@heinrich5991> then the bot only implicitely depends on the modules
13:40 < Learath2> hmm no idea how to facilitate that in nim
13:40 < Learath2> must dig in the manual :P
13:40 <@heinrich5991> neither do I, just giving programming-language agnostic advice
13:40 < Learath2> yep thats a nice idea
13:53 < Learath2> heinrich5991: what do you mean by only implicetly depends on the modules ?
13:53 <@heinrich5991> well, you define an interface, like in c++ by declaring and abstrace base class that modules are supposed to derive from
13:53 <@heinrich5991> like
13:55 <@heinrich5991> class IModule { virtual int OnInit(Bot &bot) = 0; virtual int OnMessage(const Message &message) = 0; }
13:55 <@heinrich5991> then in the bot class make a RegisterModule function that takes a pointer to that abstract interface, and adds it to the list of modules
13:56 <@heinrich5991> afk food
13:57 <@EastByte> nicely doable in nim
13:57 < Learath2> a nice reason to read the second part of the tutorial which starts with oop
14:06 < laxadedi> https://github.com/jlevy/the-art-of-command-line/blob/master/README.md
14:08 <@EastByte> explain pls
14:22 <@EastByte> Learath2: might looks like this https://gist.github.com/east/ec46c0219d24a319a328
14:23 <@EastByte> then you can make a plugin list like: plugins: seq[PluginInterface] = @[CoolPlugin(), ...]
14:25 < Savander> deen, race will be on clear Race mod or on your modification?
14:26 <@deen> Savander: on ddnet, but restricted to race features. i converted the old race maps to ddnet
14:27 < Savander> a name?
14:27 < Savander> of mod
14:27 < Savander> DDraceNetwork
14:27 <@deen> yes
14:27 < Savander> or RaceNetwork? ahha
14:27 <@heinrich5991> deen: have you converted the speedup layer too?
14:28 <@deen> i don't think so
14:28 <@EastByte> speedup layer no race?
14:28 <@deen> but our testers are testing the maps, so I hope they work
14:28 <@EastByte> on*
14:28 <@deen> yeah, haven't seen any speedupss
14:28 < Savander> on race
14:28 < Savander> no
14:28 <@heinrich5991> ddrace and race use different formats for speedups
14:28 < Savander> heinrich5991, race has speedups?
14:28 <@heinrich5991> yes
14:29 < Savander> i never seen any
14:29 <@heinrich5991> a speedup layer
14:29 <@heinrich5991> in particular that's where ddrace got its speedup/teleport layer from
14:29 <@EastByte> you spend too much time on analysing map formats
14:29 <@heinrich5991> :)
14:29 <@EastByte> :P
14:29 < Savander> hm
14:29 < Savander> btw
14:29 <@deen> This is what I did, just stopper tiles: https://github.com/def-/ddnet/blob/DDRace64/src/game/editor/io.cpp#L847-L873
14:30 <@heinrich5991> if there were no speedups then it'll be fine
14:30 <@deen> I hope the testers actually test the maps
14:30 <@deen> so they would notice
14:31 < Savander> grenades disappear after death?
14:31 < Savander> deen, ?
14:31 < Savander> it's important feature on race d
14:31 < Savander> :P
14:31 <@deen> no, i consider that a cheat
14:31 <@deen> :P
14:31 <@heinrich5991> what?
14:32 <@deen> ehm, they disappear*
14:32 <@heinrich5991> you consider it a cheat that grenades disappear on death?
14:32 <@deen> nono, the other way around
14:32 <@deen> that they don't disappear
14:32 <@heinrich5991> ah, just like in race
14:32 <@deen> in race mod
14:32 <@heinrich5991> they disappear
14:32 <@heinrich5991> when was the last time you played race? :P
14:33 < Savander> but
14:33 < Savander> meh.
14:33 < Savander> on race it was standard
14:33 < Savander> if i understand, grenades disappear
14:33 <@deen> i never played race
14:33 <@heinrich5991> in ddnet grenades disappear. in teerace grenades disappear. no difference.
14:33 < Savander> i was racer
14:33 <@deen> heinrich5991: ok, good
14:34 < Savander> 4 years on race
14:34 <@deen> because i saw race videos on YT and they use grenade + kill to get more speed at start
14:34 < Savander> ye, and every speedracer
14:34 < Savander> do it xd
14:34 < Savander> very often 3+ grenades at start
14:35 <@deen> not going to happen on ddnet, Savander, we will see how players will like that
14:36 < Savander> old racer will mad
14:36 < Savander> will be *
14:44 < Savander> which tiles will be enable for race?
14:44 <@deen> the ones that race had?
14:45 < Savander> how people will know, which they can use?D:
14:45 <@deen> for a start we're releasing old maps, so no need to know
14:46 < Savander> later?
14:47 <@deen> later we will see if we even keep the race server
14:47 <@deen> and then someone can write some explanation about what race maps are
14:48 < Savander> or switch mapress in editor
14:49 <@deen> does anyone know how i can enable/disable a bam config value like "bam config websockets=false" but for "bam config freetype.use_ftconfig=false"?
14:52 <@heinrich5991> deen: if in doubt, edit config.lua directly
14:53 <@deen> heinrich5991: hm, but somewhow i want to give users the choice whether to use pkg-config for opus and curl or use the bundled one we have with DDNet clint
14:54 <@heinrich5991> is there a reason to prefer the latter if the former is available?
14:54 <@heinrich5991> compatiblity concerns?
14:54 <@deen> by default pkg-config will be used, but yes, could be incompatible versions
14:55 <@deen> aaaand i need to select the bundled one for static builds of the release versions
14:55 <@heinrich5991> ah
14:55 <@deen> i guess people who compile themselves want to use their system libs
14:56 <@heinrich5991> and it works for websockets?
14:56 < Savander> http://www.savander.pl/img/DyYJDOKU9156.jpg old entites.png 
14:56 <@deen> for websockets it's a bit weird, because that's just a config string that only the user can set
14:57 <@deen> heinrich5991: but for curl and opus i use the module thing that's also used for freetype and sdl2
14:59 <@deen> hi BeaR_. have any experience with bam?
14:59 < BeaR_> hey
14:59 < BeaR_> a bit
14:59 < BeaR_> (using it for some projects)
14:59 <@deen> great timing!
15:00 <@deen> BeaR_: http://ddnet.tw/irc.txt
15:01 < BeaR_> this config stuff isn't part of bam actually
15:01 < BeaR_> https://github.com/teeworlds/teeworlds/blob/master/configure.lua
15:01 < BeaR_> so I doubt bam will be able to do this
15:03 <@deen> meh, then I'll just hack it in
15:03 <@deen> similar to the websockets one
15:09 <@deen> ha, got it working =)
15:33 <@deen> There we go:
15:33 < ddnet-commits> [ddnet] def- pushed 1 new commit to DDRace64: http://git.io/vqQD0
15:33 < ddnet-commits> ddnet/DDRace64 0df6866 def: Enable support to use pkg-config for curl, opusfile, opus and ogg...
15:49 < ddnet-commits> [ddnet] def- pushed 1 new commit to DDRace64: http://git.io/vqQbT
15:49 < ddnet-commits> ddnet/DDRace64 5c1ce6c def: Fix linux x86
16:06 <@deen> eeeee: can you give me a way to run apt-get on GER2? I think I found a nice way to save RAM on all servers, but need to install a few packages
16:15 < BeaR_> hm so it's possible to set variables of the lua script via commandline?
16:18 < BeaR_> nvm, via scriptargs
16:56 < ddnet-commits> [ddnet] def- pushed 1 new commit to DDRace64: http://git.io/vq74H
16:56 < ddnet-commits> ddnet/DDRace64 e163f9f def: Add support for compiling mysql with dynlibs thanks to mysql_config
17:01 < o_be_one> supp' bros
17:01 < o_be_one> deen: can i know more about what you are talking?
17:02 <@deen> what?
17:15 <@deen> Gotten the ddnet server binary with mysql down from 19 MB to 700 KB, now I hope that this has an effect on memory usage
17:15 <@deen> might make more sense to dynamically link on the official servers
17:18 < Learath2> huh how would that effect memory usage ?
17:21 <@deen> when you don't have to load in all the 19 MB binaries, but maybe it doesn't have an effect
17:22 < Learath2> oh yep should have an effect
17:22 < Learath2> iirc it does load the entire binary in memory
17:22 <@deen> it's worth a try anyway^^
17:22 <@deen> never liked 19 MB binaries
17:25 < o_be_one> deen: omg thats awesome, good work :o
17:26 <@deen> well, there was a good reason that it statically linked the libs before, they're a pain to install and depend on
17:33 < ddnet-commits> [ddnet] def- pushed 1 new commit to DDRace64: http://git.io/vq7PR
17:33 < ddnet-commits> ddnet/DDRace64 552446b def: Apply sql settings at right position
17:42 < ddnet-commits> [ddnet] def- pushed 1 new commit to DDRace64: http://git.io/vq7Do
17:42 < ddnet-commits> ddnet/DDRace64 60d035c def: Fix mysql arch x86
17:55 < Nimda> Adragaline by Silex just released on Brutal at 2015-07-10 17:51
18:41 < laxa> Yup, it is supposed to load the whole code in memory, so it's 19MB of more memory :p
19:38 < eeeee> deen: don't you have sudo?
19:39 < eeeee> oh nvm
19:45 < eeeee> should work now
19:58 <@heinrich5991> deen: you here?
20:10 <@deen> heinrich5991: yes
20:10 <@deen> eeeee: thanks
20:18 <@heinrich5991> deen: I had an idea for the configs
20:19 <@deen> works fine for my use case already, how would you improve it?
20:19 <@heinrich5991> it works fine for your use case right now, but it doesn't for mine, so I thought I could keep your work flow and improve it so it works for mine too
20:19 <@heinrich5991> the idea was to check if a map config is present, and if so, replace the current map's internals config with the config file and send it together with the map to the client
20:20 <@deen> oh, those configs, not bam config^^
20:20 <@heinrich5991> ^^
20:20 <@heinrich5991> yes
20:20 <@deen> so if we change the config the whole map has to be retransferred?
20:20 <@heinrich5991> yes
20:21 <@heinrich5991> basically like changing a single tile
20:21 <@heinrich5991> unless you're changing it while the map is loaded
20:21 <@heinrich5991> i.e. if the map is currently on the server, clients aren't disconnected
20:22 <@heinrich5991> so it works the same as before, mostly
20:22 <@heinrich5991> except that you can put the map into a arbitrary ddnet server afterwards
20:23 <@deen> i really don't think the server should overwrite map files
20:23 <@heinrich5991> that should be done just in the server memory
20:23 <@heinrich5991> i.e. where the map resides anyway due to map download
20:24 <@heinrich5991> *for the map download
20:26 <@deen> hm
20:26 <@deen> for the solo server we have sv_solo_server 1 set, but it's not in any map config
20:26 <@deen> but it's clearly necessary to play the map
20:26 <@heinrich5991> mh. I saw it in some config
20:27 <@deen> maybe some mapper added it, but it's not necessary
20:27 <@heinrich5991> ah yea, just 2
20:28 <@deen> so what happens if a mapper tests their own map with a config
20:28 <@deen> then they download it from the testserver, now the config is also embedded in the map
20:28 <@deen> and they keep editing that map
20:28 <@deen> which config runs then?
20:28 <@heinrich5991> if a config file is present, only that is run
20:28 <@heinrich5991> and embedded into the map
20:29 <@heinrich5991> if no config file is present, but inside the map there is, then the internal config is used
20:29 <@deen> i guess that's ok
20:29 <@deen> can't think of anything that would terribly break
20:29 <@heinrich5991> that's nice to hear
20:29 <@deen> except that maps will have to be downloaded a bit more often
20:29 <@heinrich5991> yea :/
20:29 <@deen> i think eeeee wanted to go in the opposite direction
20:30 <@deen> split the map up into the mapres and download them separately
20:30 <@deen> because most maps share the same mapres
20:31 <@deen> what i really don't want is a config text editor inside the editor
20:31 <@deen> because that would be terrible to use
20:31 <@deen> also, some people may think their server is doing something wrong when they check the checksum of their map and the server sends another one
20:32 <@deen> and another problem, we have 2 map configs for each map
20:32 <@deen> one is the actually important stuff that ends up in the ddnet-maps repo
20:33 <@deen> the other look like this: http://ddnet.tw/skynet1.map.cfg
20:33 <@deen> just some information about the map for sv_motd
20:33 < eeeee> i think fetching mapres from http in the client would actually be pretty easy to do, the harder part would be managing the mess on the server
20:33 <@deen> and that changes all the time of course, which would be terrible
20:33 < eeeee> extracting and versioning mapres from all the maps
22:11 <@heinrich5991> eeeee: what is the idea? extracting sounds and images from the maps and send them separately?
22:12 < ddnet-commits> [ddnet] def- pushed 1 new commit to DDRace64: http://git.io/vqdKN
22:12 < ddnet-commits> ddnet/DDRace64 242f47e def: Fix statboard a bit more!
22:27 < ddnet-commits> [ddnet] def- pushed 1 new commit to DDRace64: http://git.io/vqdDT
22:27 < ddnet-commits> ddnet/DDRace64 76e4ca1 def: Sort players in scoreboard by name too
22:30 <@deen> I think it's funny that you think I spend too much time working on DDNet. Most people tell me that I'm lazy, never do anything for DDNet and just take credit for the work of others.
22:58 < laxa> Too lazy to read everything, who is saying you are working too much on DDNet ?
23:00 <@deen> 13:26 < Learath2> Greyfox also did well but it took way too much time for him
23:00 <@deen> 13:27 <@heinrich5991> I doubt it's not also taking too much time from deen tbh
23:00 <@deen> 13:27 < Learath2> it obv is taking too much time from deen he is always around even
23:01 < laxa> How do you feel about the time you spend on ddnet ?
23:08 < eeeee> "never do anything for DDNet and just take credit for the work" <- sounds like Tsin talk
23:11 < eeeee> heinrich5991: yes. teewebs already fetches the external mapres for maps from http ondemand, so if you convert the maps to externalize all embedded mapres it'll just work. and coz it works in teewebs i think it should be easy to adapt to the desktop client.
23:25 < laxa> Funny
23:25 < laxa> A german guy came on TS and asked if I needed a "TeamSpeak developper"
23:35 < Nimda> Adrenaline 4.2 by Silex just released on Brutal at 2015-07-10 23:30
23:35 < Nimda> Adrenaline 4.1 by Silex just released on Brutal at 2015-07-10 23:30
23:35 <@deen> ^ Adrenaline 4 was too long